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Obama's Middle Class Tax Pledge In Jeopardy

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LTRT
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Post  Cincy Fan 44 Mon Aug 03, 2009 1:22 pm

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/aug/03/geithner-summers-hedge-on-tax-hikes/

Wavering on an emphatic promise he made in the spring, top White House economic adviser Lawrence H. Summers would not rule out middle-class tax increases Sunday as a way for the Obama administration to pay for a sweeping health care plan.

The statement, which was echoed by Treasury Secretary Timothy F. Geithner on Sunday's talk shows, pries open a door to the kinds of broad tax increases that Mr. Obama opposed in his campaign and that he and his advisers have ruled out since taking office in January.

In March, Mr. Summers told CNBC emphatically, "Let's be very clear. ... There are no, no tax increases this year. There are no, no tax increases next year."

On Sunday, however, Mr. Summers, the director of the National Economic Council, was much more circumspect, saying that circumstances change and options cannot be ruled out.

"There is a lot, though, there is a lot that can happen over time," Mr. Summers said when pressed on CBS' "Face the Nation" about whether the Obama administration would raise taxes on the middle class to cover the massive planned expansion of federal health care coverage and the ballooning federal deficits.

"It's never a good idea to absolutely rule things out no matter what," Mr. Summers said, elaborating by saying the administration would not act in ways that would be funded "primarily" by the middle class.

"But what the president has been completely clear on is that he is not going to pursue any of his priorities - not health care, not energy, nothing - in ways that are primarily burdening middle-class families," he said.

Mr. Geithner spoke similarly, declining to rule out broadly based tax increases, when pressed during an interview that aired Sunday. ABC's George Stephanopoulos invited Mr. Geithner five times to rule out raising taxes to pay for health care reform and/or to close the budget deficit - and he never did.

"Again, we're not at the point yet where we're going to make a judgment about what it's going to take," Mr. Geithner said on ABC's "This Week."

When asked about tax increases, "you're not ruling it out, you can't rule it out," Mr. Geithner responded: "I think that what the country needs to do is understand we're going to have to do what it takes. We're going to do what's necessary."

His remarks differed from Mr. Summers' words in March and contradicted what Mr. Obama called "a firm pledge" that no one other than the rich would have taxes raised.

"I can make a firm pledge. Under my plan, no family making less than $250,000 a year will see any form of tax increase. Not your income tax, not your payroll tax, not your capital gains taxes, not any of your taxes," he told an audience Sept. 12 in Dover, N.H.

But Mr. Obama also has made health care reform a priority in his first year in office, and congressional gridlock over how to pay for any measure appears to have softened the administration's stance against tax increases.
Broken Campaign Promises for $200, Alex...
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Post  Guest Mon Aug 03, 2009 1:39 pm

Buyers remorse looks so bad on you Cincy. One, Washington Times is a conservative newspaper and at this point everything should be on the table and lets see what is left there when it comes time to implement.
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Post  LTRT Mon Aug 03, 2009 1:54 pm

Bman wrote:Buyers remorse looks so bad on you Cincy. One, Washington Times is a conservative newspaper and at this point everything should be on the table and lets see what is left there when it comes time to implement.

Obama officials: Taxes may rise to pay health care
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090803/ap_on_go_pr_wh/us_economy

By PHILIP ELLIOTT, Associated Press Writer Mon Aug 3, 9:43 am ET
WASHINGTON Two of President Barack Obama's economic heavyweights said middle-class taxes might have to go up to pare budget deficits or to pay for the proposed overhaul of the nation's health care system.

So I suppose you're now going to tell us that the AP is a conservative news outlet. Give it a rest. Rolling Eyes
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Post  Guest Mon Aug 03, 2009 1:56 pm

Agreed Bman. If Cincy were talking about an actual broken campain promise, instead of pushing his chips on Red 40 and spinning the wheel in apparent hopes of a failure, it would be justified.

To date, can anyone say that any of Obama's policies have been for the worse for Americans? the "threat avoidance" is a moving target. I think he's done an outstanding job given what's been thrown at him. Basically all I see happening recently is the GOP trying to slow things (him) down rather than help.

So to Cincy I'd ask, are these emotional concerns or real concerns? Is it just worry or do you really feel Obama has made changes for the worse - for you personally? Do you think he's made changes for the worse for the other people your vote represents?

Imagine this mess with McCain and Palin... feels better now doesn't it?
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Post  Guest Mon Aug 03, 2009 1:58 pm

LTRT wrote:
Bman wrote:Buyers remorse looks so bad on you Cincy. One, Washington Times is a conservative newspaper and at this point everything should be on the table and lets see what is left there when it comes time to implement.

Obama officials: Taxes may rise to pay health care
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090803/ap_on_go_pr_wh/us_economy

By PHILIP ELLIOTT, Associated Press Writer Mon Aug 3, 9:43 am ET
WASHINGTON Two of President Barack Obama's economic heavyweights said middle-class taxes might have to go up to pare budget deficits or to pay for the proposed overhaul of the nation's health care system.

So I suppose you're now going to tell us that the AP is a conservative news outlet. Give it a rest. Rolling Eyes

Good Lord man! When will you turn off the TV and quit believing every article that uses the word "MAY" in the title? I prefer to focus on realities and not fantasy fear.
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Post  LTRT Mon Aug 03, 2009 2:13 pm

meta4 wrote:
LTRT wrote:
Bman wrote:Buyers remorse looks so bad on you Cincy. One, Washington Times is a conservative newspaper and at this point everything should be on the table and lets see what is left there when it comes time to implement.

Obama officials: Taxes may rise to pay health care
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090803/ap_on_go_pr_wh/us_economy

By PHILIP ELLIOTT, Associated Press Writer Mon Aug 3, 9:43 am ET
WASHINGTON Two of President Barack Obama's economic heavyweights said middle-class taxes might have to go up to pare budget deficits or to pay for the proposed overhaul of the nation's health care system.

So I suppose you're now going to tell us that the AP is a conservative news outlet. Give it a rest. Rolling Eyes

Good Lord man! When will you turn off the TV and quit believing every article that uses the word "MAY" in the title? I prefer to focus on realities and not fantasy fear.

Will you quit believing everything that comes out of the WH?

$100 says the middle class tax rates will increase. Very Happy
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Post  Guest Mon Aug 03, 2009 2:15 pm

LTRT wrote:$100 says the middle class tax rates will increase. Very Happy

$386.00 says yours will too. I'm not sure what bracket you're in, just making a blanket statement.
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Post  Scooby01_98 Mon Aug 03, 2009 2:36 pm

The Bush tax cuts expire at the end of 2010. So Mr. Summers was very clear about this year and next, which leads you to believe they are not going to work on extending the tax cuts for anyone. So those in the 0% (threshold goes down to where they start to pay) and 10% will get a jump up to 15%. Those in the 15% will get a jump to 28%. Those in the 25% & 28% goes to 31%. Those in the 33% goes to 36% and the 35% goes to 39.5%. Along with the marriage penalty coming back and reduction in the child tax credit.

Yep will be interesting to see with the 2010 elections coming up at the same time.

But hey already started the increase anyway with cap and tax, cigarette, working on the old food tax etc.
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Post  Cincy Fan 44 Mon Aug 03, 2009 2:37 pm

You're all right, I should probably just bury my head in the sand and pretend that they're not even entertaining the thought of breaking one of their fundamental campaign promises. I'll just continue girding my loins. Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain...
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Post  Guest Mon Aug 03, 2009 3:34 pm

Cincy Fan 44 wrote:You're all right, I should probably just bury my head in the sand and pretend that they're not even entertaining the thought of breaking one of their fundamental campaign promises. I'll just continue girding my loins. Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain...

Naw, lets take this thread to 13 pages debating whether or not it will happen by making abstract subjective observations on soft-facts that do/don't support the outcome we desire. I mean, who's really in control with veto power? I think the time to discuss this would be closer towards that bill signing/veto moment. For now it's a (chicken) little bit premature. IMO of course. It's just news media fluff.

You voted for Obama for what reasons?
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Post  Guest Mon Aug 03, 2009 3:36 pm

Scooby01_98 wrote:The Bush tax cuts expire at the end of 2010. So Mr. Summers was very clear about this year and next, which leads you to believe they are not going to work on extending the tax cuts for anyone. So those in the 0% (threshold goes down to where they start to pay) and 10% will get a jump up to 15%. Those in the 15% will get a jump to 28%. Those in the 25% & 28% goes to 31%. Those in the 33% goes to 36% and the 35% goes to 39.5%. Along with the marriage penalty coming back and reduction in the child tax credit.

Yep will be interesting to see with the 2010 elections coming up at the same time.

But hey already started the increase anyway with cap and tax, cigarette, working on the old food tax etc.

Apparently my head has been in the sand... where's that cap'n tax stuff again?
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Post  Guest Mon Aug 03, 2009 7:51 pm

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2009/08/03/white-house-steadfast-on-pledge-of-no-middle-class-tax-increase/


Obama pledges to uphold that campaign promise. Any pundit can write an article saying "may" ... fluck that ...

Opinions are just like assholes, everyone has one but some just resemble them more.
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Post  LTRT Mon Aug 03, 2009 7:58 pm

Bman wrote:http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2009/08/03/white-house-steadfast-on-pledge-of-no-middle-class-tax-increase/


Obama pledges to uphold that campaign promise. Any pundit can write an article saying "may" ... fluck that ...

Opinions are just like assholes, everyone has one but some just resemble them more.

Are you speaking from experience?

This one is easy to answer, simple copy & paste...

Will you quit believing everything that comes out of the WH?

$100 says the middle class tax rates will increase. Very Happy
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Post  Markwes Mon Aug 03, 2009 9:02 pm

Bman wrote:http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2009/08/03/white-house-steadfast-on-pledge-of-no-middle-class-tax-increase/


Obama pledges to uphold that campaign promise. Any pundit can write an article saying "may" ... fluck that ...

Opinions are just like assholes, everyone has one but some just resemble them more.
From your link...
The concern came after the Obama administration's two top money men floated the idea that tax increases to fund the nation's economic recovery could extend beyond the wealthiest Americans.
So, I'm confused. You're blaming the writer?
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Post  floridafun Mon Aug 03, 2009 11:34 pm

i thought we pretty much agreed back when the race was between mccain, hillary and obama..it was likely the next prez would need to increase taxes some? and that was long before we ever would have guessed the financial upheaval internationally and nationallywe went thru in fall and winter..and continuing into now altho seeming improved a bit.
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Post  Scooby01_98 Tue Aug 04, 2009 12:49 am

meta4 wrote:
Scooby01_98 wrote:The Bush tax cuts expire at the end of 2010. So Mr. Summers was very clear about this year and next, which leads you to believe they are not going to work on extending the tax cuts for anyone. So those in the 0% (threshold goes down to where they start to pay) and 10% will get a jump up to 15%. Those in the 15% will get a jump to 28%. Those in the 25% & 28% goes to 31%. Those in the 33% goes to 36% and the 35% goes to 39.5%. Along with the marriage penalty coming back and reduction in the child tax credit.

Yep will be interesting to see with the 2010 elections coming up at the same time.

But hey already started the increase anyway with cap and tax, cigarette, working on the old food tax etc.

Apparently my head has been in the sand... where's that cap'n tax stuff again?

Cap and Tax passed in the house, in the Senate for debate. Cigarette signed by the president. Food tax was in one of the committee health care bills in the house, not sure if it has been dropped yet.
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Post  Guest Tue Aug 04, 2009 7:38 am

floridafun wrote:i thought we pretty much agreed back when the race was between mccain, hillary and obama..it was likely the next prez would need to increase taxes some? and that was long before we ever would have guessed the financial upheaval internationally and nationallywe went thru in fall and winter..and continuing into now altho seeming improved a bit.

Seems like you're looking for a way to excuse the Obama adminstration's plan to go back on it's word and not raise taxes a single dime on people making less than $250K. Both Larry Somers and Tim tax cheat Geitner said this weekend that everything is on the table and that Americans need to be prepared for the adminstration to do whatever it takes to fix the economy. These statements were in reference to tax cuts on the middle class.

Grab your ankles everyone.
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Post  Pez Tue Aug 04, 2009 10:14 am

Kroman wrote:
floridafun wrote:i thought we pretty much agreed back when the race was between mccain, hillary and obama..it was likely the next prez would need to increase taxes some? and that was long before we ever would have guessed the financial upheaval internationally and nationallywe went thru in fall and winter..and continuing into now altho seeming improved a bit.

Seems like you're looking for a way to excuse the Obama adminstration's plan to go back on it's word and not raise taxes a single dime on people making less than $250K. Both Larry Somers and Tim tax cheat Geitner said this weekend that everything is on the table and that Americans need to be prepared for the adminstration to do whatever it takes to fix the economy. These statements were in reference to tax cuts on the middle class.

Grab your ankles everyone.

The administration made a statement that they continue to pledge not to raise taxes on the Middle class (those makeing less than 250,000)... I am not sure how that will be possible, given the economic situations we are in, but we will see...

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Post  Guest Tue Aug 04, 2009 10:26 am

Pez wrote:
Kroman wrote:
floridafun wrote:i thought we pretty much agreed back when the race was between mccain, hillary and obama..it was likely the next prez would need to increase taxes some? and that was long before we ever would have guessed the financial upheaval internationally and nationallywe went thru in fall and winter..and continuing into now altho seeming improved a bit.

Seems like you're looking for a way to excuse the Obama adminstration's plan to go back on it's word and not raise taxes a single dime on people making less than $250K. Both Larry Somers and Tim tax cheat Geitner said this weekend that everything is on the table and that Americans need to be prepared for the adminstration to do whatever it takes to fix the economy. These statements were in reference to tax cuts on the middle class.

Grab your ankles everyone.

The administration made a statement that they continue to pledge not to raise taxes on the Middle class (those makeing less than 250,000)... I am not sure how that will be possible, given the economic situations we are in, but we will see...

just hammer the rich harder ... leave the middle class alone. Pretty simple.
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Post  Scooby01_98 Tue Aug 04, 2009 11:40 am

Bman wrote:

just hammer the rich harder ... leave the middle class alone. Pretty simple.

Yeah that 70% tax rate worked so well under the Carter administration.
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Post  floridafun Tue Aug 04, 2009 12:59 pm

Scooby01_98 wrote:
meta4 wrote:
Scooby01_98 wrote:The Bush tax cuts expire at the end of 2010. But hey already started the increase anyway with cap and tax, cigarette, working on the old food tax etc.

Apparently my head has been in the sand... where's that cap'n tax stuff again?

Cap and Tax passed in the house, in the Senate for debate. Cigarette signed by the president. Food tax was in one of the committee health care bills in the house, not sure if it has been dropped yet.

is cap and trade for companies that CHOOSE not to invest in running more green over a period of time? that was my understanding of it. cig tax is paid by those of us who OPT to continue the habit --and doesnt the tax go back into the system by helping offset the cost of schip? i dont like my cigs costing more but if i want them i will pay, and find somewhere else i can spend less. the food tax..primarily on soda and sugary unhealthy fruit drinks to start and possibly eventually on alcohol drinks and fast foods will be paid by those who opt to buy them, wont matter to me because those things are an occasional thing i am willing to pay extra tax on..for those for whom it is a consistent staple they will be contributing to their eventual health care woes. i dont see it as a bad thing. nobody ever promised me costs wouldnt go up periodically on my foods or prep items used imn cooking, or my beverage of choice..whether thru a tax or thru producers of foods or coffee or whatever. did food costs go up in the last 8 years with NO taxes? mine did but maybe it was just me..
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Post  Scooby01_98 Tue Aug 04, 2009 1:56 pm

floridafun wrote:

is cap and trade for companies that CHOOSE not to invest in running more green over a period of time? that was my understanding of it. cig tax is paid by those of us who OPT to continue the habit --and doesnt the tax go back into the system by helping offset the cost of schip? i dont like my cigs costing more but if i want them i will pay, and find somewhere else i can spend less. the food tax..primarily on soda and sugary unhealthy fruit drinks to start and possibly eventually on alcohol drinks and fast foods will be paid by those who opt to buy them, wont matter to me because those things are an occasional thing i am willing to pay extra tax on..for those for whom it is a consistent staple they will be contributing to their eventual health care woes. i dont see it as a bad thing. nobody ever promised me costs wouldnt go up periodically on my foods or prep items used imn cooking, or my beverage of choice..whether thru a tax or thru producers of foods or coffee or whatever. did food costs go up in the last 8 years with NO taxes? mine did but maybe it was just me..

Tax and cap for any company that does reduce emissions back to a 90's (i forget which year) emission standard. The cost will be passed along to everyone for this tax. Hits utility, heavy industries, transportation companies the hardest.

Cigarettes, what income of people smoke the most? Low income while the tax pays for schip, it is a tax on low income people, not those making over 250K.

Food tax everything that contains sugar, corn frucoste, etc. Look at your ingredients labels and see what products contain that ingredient. Then lets throw in a fast food tax or will it really be a high calorie tax that hits every restaurant? This will also include fresh fruit (high in sugar).

So you're going to compare inflation for increase in the price of food for the last eight year to being no different than adding a tax to it now?
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Post  Pez Tue Aug 04, 2009 2:10 pm

Scooby01_98 wrote:
Bman wrote:

just hammer the rich harder ... leave the middle class alone. Pretty simple.

Yeah that 70% tax rate worked so well under the Carter administration.

It's been 30 years since carter was in office... Scooby is OLD...

j/k... I dont think we need to "hammer" anyone with taxes... I also think Obama made a tactical error when he committed to not raising taxes as he isnt leaving his options open... which is kind of contrary to what I feel he offers as president, the ability to do the right thing in the face of political pressure otherwise... He will raise taxes on those making less that 250k, and it will be a big embarrassment when he does (read... my... lips)...

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Post  LTRT Tue Aug 04, 2009 2:34 pm

Pez wrote:... He will raise taxes on those making less that 250k, and it will be a big embarrassment when he does (read... my... lips)...

I owe you a dozen of Cookie Cottage cookies for the post of the day. Very Happy
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Post  floridafun Tue Aug 04, 2009 5:38 pm

Scooby01_98 wrote:
floridafun wrote:

is cap and trade for companies that CHOOSE not to invest in running more green over a period of time? that was my understanding of it. cig tax is paid by those of us who OPT to continue the habit --and doesnt the tax go back into the system by helping offset the cost of schip? i dont like my cigs costing more but if i want them i will pay, and find somewhere else i can spend less. the food tax..primarily on soda and sugary unhealthy fruit drinks to start and possibly eventually on alcohol drinks and fast foods will be paid by those who opt to buy them, wont matter to me because those things are an occasional thing i am willing to pay extra tax on..for those for whom it is a consistent staple they will be contributing to their eventual health care woes. i dont see it as a bad thing. nobody ever promised me costs wouldnt go up periodically on my foods or prep items used imn cooking, or my beverage of choice..whether thru a tax or thru producers of foods or coffee or whatever. did food costs go up in the last 8 years with NO taxes? mine did but maybe it was just me..

Tax and cap for any company that does reduce emissions back to a 90's (i forget which year) emission standard. The cost will be passed along to everyone for this tax. Hits utility, heavy industries, transportation companies the hardest.

Cigarettes, what income of people smoke the most? Low income while the tax pays for schip, it is a tax on low income people, not those making over 250K.

Food tax everything that contains sugar, corn frucoste, etc. Look at your ingredients labels and see what products contain that ingredient. Then lets throw in a fast food tax or will it really be a high calorie tax that hits every restaurant? This will also include fresh fruit (high in sugar).

So you're going to compare inflation for increase in the price of food for the last eight year to being no different than adding a tax to it now?

tax and cap..for industried that DO? reduce emissions to back at 90's levels?

i havent seen anywhere that the food tax would be on any fresh procuce. or healthy foods.

like cigarettes, you only pay the tax if you opt to buy the product. i dont see targeted unhealthy product taxes equaling across the board taxing. and between me and my checking account, if i have to pay a dollar more suddenly for a gallon of milk or 5 lb of coffee..it dont much matter whether its because of a permanent tax or permanent inflation. paying more equals paying more. when the cost of oj goes up because they had freezing conditions where it was grown..it sure doesnt go back down in price the next year when they have abundant crops.


like i asked..did your grocery prices increase in the last 8 years where there were no tax increases? did blaming it on the cost of doing business or inflation or whatever instead of blaming it on taxes make it feel better when you forked over more money?
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