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floridafun wrote:so your hoping they have a real appreciation of the difference between being raped and/or murdered by our military and our contractors instead of by their former dictator?

You should talk to our new friend from France to see what you need to do to move there.

so your hoping they have a real appreciation of the difference between being raped and/or murdered by our military and our contractors instead of by their former dictator?[/quote]

so your hoping they have a real appreciation of the difference between being raped and/or murdered by our military and our contractors instead of by their former dictator?

Mort wrote:

Next time I talk to my brother in law I'll have to tell him that some people on a message board that I frequent labeled as "The Lighter Side of Fort Wayne" think he's a murderer and rapist. Maybe he has some good rape stories to tell me.

Markwes wrote:Next time I talk to my brother in law I'll have to tell him that some people on a message board that I frequent labeled as "The Lighter Side of Fort Wayne" think he's a murderer and rapist. Maybe he has some good rape stories to tell me.

I think you should, Mark. Just so we can hear you whine about it.

Jugomugo wrote:

Markwes wrote:Next time I talk to my brother in law I'll have to tell him that some people on a message board that I frequent labeled as "The Lighter Side of Fort Wayne" think he's a murderer and rapist. Maybe he has some good rape stories to tell me.

I think you should, Mark. Just so we can hear you whine about it.

If responding to an asinine statement is whining, then so be it. So am I the only one here who takes offense to FF's comment?

Markwes wrote:

Jugomugo wrote:

Markwes wrote:Next time I talk to my brother in law I'll have to tell him that some people on a message board that I frequent labeled as "The Lighter Side of Fort Wayne" think he's a murderer and rapist. Maybe he has some good rape stories to tell me.

I think you should, Mark. Just so we can hear you whine about it.

If responding to an asinine statement is whining, then so be it. So am I the only one here who takes offense to FF's comment?

Oh it was her that made that comment, for a minute I thought John Murtha had joined our board.

Markwes wrote:

Jugomugo wrote:

Markwes wrote:Next time I talk to my brother in law I'll have to tell him that some people on a message board that I frequent labeled as "The Lighter Side of Fort Wayne" think he's a murderer and rapist. Maybe he has some good rape stories to tell me.

I think you should, Mark. Just so we can hear you whine about it.

If responding to an asinine statement is whining, then so be it. So am I the only one here who takes offense to FF's comment?

I know I certainly don't give a damn.

Markwes wrote:

Jugomugo wrote:

Markwes wrote:Next time I talk to my brother in law I'll have to tell him that some people on a message board that I frequent labeled as "The Lighter Side of Fort Wayne" think he's a murderer and rapist. Maybe he has some good rape stories to tell me.

I think you should, Mark. Just so we can hear you whine about it.

If responding to an asinine statement is whining, then so be it. So am I the only one here who takes offense to FF's comment?

Just consider the source and move on. I did.

Jugomugo wrote:

Markwes wrote:

Jugomugo wrote:

Markwes wrote:Next time I talk to my brother in law I'll have to tell him that some people on a message board that I frequent labeled as "The Lighter Side of Fort Wayne" think he's a murderer and rapist. Maybe he has some good rape stories to tell me.

I think you should, Mark. Just so we can hear you whine about it.

If responding to an asinine statement is whining, then so be it. So am I the only one here who takes offense to FF's comment?

I know I certainly don't give a damn.

Well, I think we all knew that already.

Cincy Fan 44 wrote:

Markwes wrote:

Jugomugo wrote:

Markwes wrote:Next time I talk to my brother in law I'll have to tell him that some people on a message board that I frequent labeled as "The Lighter Side of Fort Wayne" think he's a murderer and rapist. Maybe he has some good rape stories to tell me.

I think you should, Mark. Just so we can hear you whine about it.

If responding to an asinine statement is whining, then so be it. So am I the only one here who takes offense to FF's comment?

Just consider the source and move on. I did.

You are exactly correct. I keep giving a damn, so to speak, and as you said I need to consider the source and move on. Thanks Cincy!

just sayin' ....should we pretend the many intentional government-sponsored murders of innocents and other non-terrorist-related atrocities arent happening, havent been happening for a loooong time in iraq? i choose not to, based NOT on what i would like to believe but based on what the many people who have witnessed and/or participated in these events have said and continue to say.. not that everyone who goes there probably becomes an intentional random killer of known innocents. but we will never know how many do.

disgusting that i mentioned it? or disgusting that it happens?


http://ivaw.org/wintersoldier/testimony

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ys5bC0esMKU&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F2gkPzlcRpI&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvdGHlHCblk&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qoJHTuP7Lh0&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VwwMF6biCJU&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R0WZvDa0Uvs&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z0qs71TYwoM&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_-31rFCVLg

floridafun wrote:just sayin' ....should we pretend the many intentional government-sponsored murders of innocents and other non-terrorist-related atrocities arent happening, havent been happening for a loooong time in iraq? i choose not to, based NOT on what i would like to believe but based on what the many people who have witnessed and/or participated in these events have said and continue to say.. not that everyone who goes there probably becomes an intentional random killer of known innocents. but we will never know how many do.

disgusting that i mentioned it? or disgusting that it happens?


http://ivaw.org/wintersoldier/testimony

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ys5bC0esMKU&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F2gkPzlcRpI&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvdGHlHCblk&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qoJHTuP7Lh0&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VwwMF6biCJU&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R0WZvDa0Uvs&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z0qs71TYwoM&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_-31rFCVLg

Disgusting that you focus on it. Here is what you do. You believe what you want to and then look for anything to support it. In this case you hate Bush, so you are going to knock down anything positive about Iraq, i.e. removing an evil dictator, just so you make sure nothing positive is seen in the Bush presidency. I can do the same thing with any outlandish claim. Here's an example. I'm going to make the claim that women are the root of all evil. I googled that claim and came up with all kinds of "sources". So there you are, it must be true.

http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/1675/index2.html

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bsue-PcJpBE

http://www.paklinks.com/gs/gupshup-cafe/7332-women-root-all-evil.html

Markwes wrote:
Disgusting that you focus on it. Here is what you do. You believe what you want to and then look for anything to support it. In this case you hate Bush, so you are going to knock down anything positive about Iraq, i.e. removing an evil dictator, just so you make sure nothing positive is seen in the Bush presidency. I can do the same thing with any outlandish claim. Here's an example. I'm going to make the claim that women are the root of all evil. I googled that claim and came up with all kinds of "sources". So there you are, it must be true.

I'm not going to get into the whole argument that you completely dodged. I just wanted to post that your tangential abstract examples don't defend your position, and are a weak attack against your opponent in an argument. Here's an idea, try thinking in terms of reality - not fantasy, and use examples that are in context to address your opponent's argument. It works a lot better.

Though, I think you are "intelligent" and maybe it seems that fatiguing your point with bad logical comparisons makes sense and maybe it tends to make you look smarter, or more wise.

Your shit is weak.

meta4 wrote:
I'm not going to get into the whole argument that you completely dodged. I just wanted to post that your tangential abstract examples don't defend your position, and are a weak attack against your opponent in an argument. Here's an idea, try thinking in terms of reality - not fantasy, and use examples that are in context to address your opponent's argument. It works a lot better.

Though, I think you are "intelligent" and maybe it seems that fatiguing your point with bad logical comparisons makes sense and maybe it tends to make you look smarter, or more wise.

Your shit is weak.

There is no "argument" against someone claiming that our military and contractors in Iraq are murderers and rapists. You chastise me for not providing an argument while doing the exact same thing. Come on, prove to me that women aren't the root of all evil.

Most American soldiers are great but there are some bad apples over there. FF is accurate in that we have had some issues with soldiers going overboard over there and raping and killing innocent people. We also had the prison scene Abu Grab, which made our service men and women look pretty bad. Are they all bad ... no ... should FF have stated that not all soldiers are bad sure she should have but Markwes also needs to admit that there are some bad apples over there and some seriously sick shit has happened. I blame Bush and Cheney for this sick shit because they basically condon it ... have you seen Cheney's most recent interviews. Hell, he defended himself for telling Senator Leahy to go f* himself. Cheney also said he did not care that no WMDs were found that we were invading Iraq with or with out them. Cheney is a crazed idiot, Bush's political legacy is tied to this darth vadar creep he picked as VP.

Bman wrote:Most American soldiers are great but there are some bad apples over there. FF is accurate in that we have had some issues with soldiers going overboard over there and raping and killing innocent people. We also had the prison scene Abu Grab, which made our service men and women look pretty bad. Are they all bad ... no ... should FF have stated that not all soldiers are bad sure she should have but Markwes also needs to admit that there are some bad apples over there and some seriously sick shit has happened. I blame Bush and Cheney for this sick shit because they basically condon it ... have you seen Cheney's most recent interviews. Hell, he defended himself for telling Senator Leahy to go f* himself. Cheney also said he did not care that no WMDs were found that we were invading Iraq with or with out them. Cheney is a crazed idiot, Bush's political legacy is tied to this darth vadar creep he picked as VP.

-1 for misspelling Darth Vader's name

Is anyone surprised that war makes people go "mad" as in insane? Apocalypse Now? Mental Illness is often caused by trauma. That is to say that traumatic events and circumstances often develop into mental illnesses. The war zone is a very fertile ground for this kind of thing.

This trauma, and subsequent illness is now commonly referred to as PTSD and that is a big umbrella term for a bunch of symptoms. Mental health diagnosis is difficult to understand sometimes, in that the patient is often not capable of seeing their own "forest for the trees" as it relates to their own condition. Maybe they don't call it manic-depressive bipolar to the patient, but they call it something like "generalized anxiety".

Maybe that's a bit confusing except for anyone who has ever worked in mental health, or cared for someone with a mental illness, it's important for the caregiver or observer to be able to have cognitive dissonance.

Markwes wrote:

meta4 wrote:
I'm not going to get into the whole argument that you completely dodged. I just wanted to post that your tangential abstract examples don't defend your position, and are a weak attack against your opponent in an argument. Here's an idea, try thinking in terms of reality - not fantasy, and use examples that are in context to address your opponent's argument. It works a lot better.

Though, I think you are "intelligent" and maybe it seems that fatiguing your point with bad logical comparisons makes sense and maybe it tends to make you look smarter, or more wise.

Your shit is weak.

There is no "argument" against someone claiming that our military and contractors in Iraq are murderers and rapists. You chastise me for not providing an argument while doing the exact same thing. Come on, prove to me that women aren't the root of all evil.

Are you ready to hear my argument? Ok, here it is. You are a loon. You chose to argue against her comment. Now defend your claim! She has certainly gone to the trouble of providing you with multiple reports of specific examples of this behavior. She didn't blanket the entire US military, she's focusing on the incidents, and the military's response to those incidents. This isn't rocket surgery man.

Prove your (currently) weak ass argument, or quit harassing/antagonizing FloridaFun for posting her thought provoking perspective.

I choose to dodge your douch-bag pseudo-argument. Women are not the root of all evil. The Bible says so.

meta4 wrote:
Are you ready to hear my argument? Ok, here it is. You are a loon. You chose to argue against her comment. Now defend your claim! She has certainly gone to the trouble of providing you with multiple reports of specific examples of this behavior. She didn't blanket the entire US military, she's focusing on the incidents, and the military's response to those incidents. This isn't rocket surgery man.

Prove your (currently) weak ass argument, or quit harassing/antagonizing FloridaFun for posting her thought provoking perspective.

I choose to dodge your douch-bag pseudo-argument. Women are not the root of all evil. The Bible says so.

This is why it's pointless to have any kind of discussion with you. You turn one statement into another that can't be debated. Her original thought provoking perspective did blanket the entire US military. Ooh, she's provided specific examples. Whoopee, I never said there were no bad apples. If that's the argument, then I guess we agree.

By the way, when did they start performing surgery on rockets?

What do you think they were doing when that astronaut lost the tool bag in space?
That was rocket surgery.

Markwes wrote:

meta4 wrote:
Are you ready to hear my argument? Ok, here it is. You are a loon. You chose to argue against her comment. Now defend your claim! She has certainly gone to the trouble of providing you with multiple reports of specific examples of this behavior. She didn't blanket the entire US military, she's focusing on the incidents, and the military's response to those incidents. This isn't rocket surgery man.

Prove your (currently) weak ass argument, or quit harassing/antagonizing FloridaFun for posting her thought provoking perspective.

I choose to dodge your douch-bag pseudo-argument. Women are not the root of all evil. The Bible says so.

This is why it's pointless to have any kind of discussion with you. You turn one statement into another that can't be debated. Her original thought provoking perspective did blanket the entire US military. Ooh, she's provided specific examples. Whoopee, I never said there were no bad apples. If that's the argument, then I guess we agree.

By the way, when did they start performing surgery on rockets?

You're missing my point by responding to me. You haven't finished making a point with FF. I'm just waiting contently to see if you will attempt to do it.

I suppose it'll be easier for you now to choose to argue with me instead of addressing, as you say, the two apparent sides of the issue.

Rocket surgery... sarcasm! You got it!

meta4 wrote:You're missing my point by responding to me. You haven't finished making a point with FF. I'm just waiting contently to see if you will attempt to do it.

I suppose it'll be easier for you now to choose to argue with me instead of addressing, as you say, the two apparent sides of the issue.

I made by point a long time ago when I told FF I was "disgusted that you focus on it". That's pretty much it! Maybe 95% of our troops there our doing the right thing, but she's focusing on the 5% or whatever number it is that are not! I don't know what else I can say about it. Why you continue arguing about my lack of arguing to a statement you were not even involved with is beyond me. But if calling me a loon and such makes you feel better, knock yourself out.

Markwes wrote:
I made by point a long time ago when I told FF I was "disgusted that you focus on it". That's pretty much it! Maybe 95% of our troops there our doing the right thing, but she's focusing on the 5% or whatever number it is that are not!

So lemme see if I get this straight... 5% unemployment is a problem. However, 5% of the soldiers breaking Geneva convention guidelines is just something we shouldn't focus on because Bush had nothing to do with it, Cheney had nothing to do with it, and your relatives or friends that were/are in the military say everything is OK.

Funny, I thought you said you made a point. That "disgusted" statement sounds exactly like an ad hominem attack on FF for "focusing" as you put it.

...hey if you make another "point" to follow that one, maybe it would qualify for the minimum # of points that constitute an argument.

Maybe you could ad hom about how FF focuses on the drama by posting 10 links from YouTube instead of 3 from the New Republic. Maybe you then you could express how you feel that this woman (FF) is accusing your family/friends/etc. of being murders... not for it's hyperbole attached to the rest of your argument, but just to be a douche.

Who knows, after another 5 pages of finger painting pictures with shit paint... you could then blame HER for bringing this debate up...